Eloquence faces future challenge

HP touts product as Oracle alternative

HP’s recommendation for the most compatible IMAGE/SQL database replacement continues its “permanent temporary” lifespan this year. And HP 3000 customers considering migration away from the platform might be able to read a similar future into their server, since HP’s forecast of Eloquence’s lifespan hasn’t been so precise.

When Eloquence appeared for HP 250 and HP 260 customers in 1990, neither its creators or HP considered the IMAGE work-alike to be a long-term solution. After a few years of gaining TurboIMAGE functions, the database is now being touted in HP’s migration support Webcasts as a key element of successful data movement off HP 3000s. More than a decade after German firm Marxmeier Software AG unveiled the product, a 7.0 Eloquence release this fall promises to deliver near-complete compatibility with IMAGE/SQL.

But customers continue to consider how long Eloquence can carry on the familiar architecture which HP introduced in IMAGE, running on Unix and NT platforms. Some customers posed the question in last month’s Webcast on database issues, wondering how Eloquence could survive against Oracle and SQL Server, or even IBM’s DB2 for its iSeries.

“I don’t see a reason why we should go away over the next 10 years,” replied Eloquence creator Michael Marxmeier in the Webcast. “We are a permanent temporary solution, and we are happy to do that.”

The software was intended as a stepping stone to Oracle when it was first released, according to SIG Softvend chairman Birket Foster. But more than 2,000 installations later, many have dropped the second step.

“Eloquence was originally proposed as a two-step process,” he said. “You moved things to Eloquence on your way to Oracle. At least 40 percent of those customers have stopped with Eloquence.” Foster’s firm MB Foster Associates is planning Eloquence training, and the company’s UDA Link will be supporting the database in a future release. Foster said he’s watching to see how the customers embrace the software.

“I want to know how much development people are planning on doing with it beyond migration,” he said. “Is there ever going to be XML query in Eloquence? Is any community college ever going to teach Eloquence? Will you be able to get staff? How many people have database design experience?”

About 60 software vendors have built applications and utilities around the installed base, but only about 300 of the 2,000 installations have anything to do with HP 3000s today. The software has only been proven to scale to 300 concurrent users and databases of 500Gb. Those aren’t numbers that will work for the most challenging interactive applications in the 3000 community, said Adager’s Alfredo Rego.

“People are doling out liberal doses of hype and talk,” he said. “A live test, with 1,000 users online doing transaction processing, will be the deciding factor — a real-life performance benchmark with Amisys, Open Skies or Ecometry, not a toy thing.”

Marxmeier acknowledged that the indexed design of Eloquence is less efficient that IMAGE’s hashing technique, but added that “hashing is less portable.”

Two application vendors have stepped forward to announce they will use Eloquence to replace IMAGE/SQL in ports of software to non-3000 platforms. Summit Information Systems continues to beta-test its port of its Spectrum credit union software this summer. That project had a June release date which has already passed.

More recently, Quintessential School Systems announced it will be releasing its Vista student records system using Eloquence running on HP-UX. Vista is built with Speedware, and Eloquence fits into the cost-conscious budgets of the K-12 school districts that Quintessential serves.

“Speedware is supporting HP Eloquence,” Percox said. “Our [Vista] product that uses Speedware is following the options given to us by Speedware, and by the prevailing market conditions presented by our vertical market, which is price-sensitive,” said QSS founder Duane Percox.

Lower-cost alternative

Another advantage is the product’s cost compared to Oracle. Even SQL Server, hosted on Intel-based Windows NT servers, is more expensive to install than Eloquence. ”Our market needs a reasonable cost alternative to Oracle,” Percox said.

He added that he’s got no reservations about offering his customers a solution built upon a database with a small customer base. The 12 years of Eloquence’s history seem to mean more than its 2,000 users. “Given their long-term existing user community, I feel pretty good about this,” he said.

Migration to non-3000 platforms makes sense for QSS for the same economic reasons. Leaving behind the higher acquisition costs associated with HP 3000 hardware opens up sales prospects for the application, which has been in production for more than 15 years.

Working with such established 3000 vendors could make Eloquence a better fit over the next year, Foster said.

“Part of it is just experience,” he said. “There’s extremely experienced vendors working with [Marxmeier]. He is working to make sure it matches up with the TurboIMAGE experience you’d have on an HP 3000, and then beyond. He’s got b-trees on any field you want them on, for example.”

Another advantage Eloquence claims over the better-known Oracle and other alternatives is performance. Since Eloquence can be accessed from traditional IMAGE APIs, existing applications programmed to use IMAGE intrinsics won’t get as bogged down — so sites will see better performance than the 20 to 50 percent slowdown HP promised for Oracle or SQL Server on the Webcast.

Eloquence’s most successful HP 3000 customers may be the ones who can step away from existing data structures. Alan Yeo, president of ScreenJet Ltd. and a supplier of HP 3000 applications through Affirm, Ltd., said, “If you don’t give a darn about what the data structure you use, I think Eloquence will work for you. But some customers probably know they need to be going to a mainstream database.”

Chris Koppe of Platinum migration partner Speedware said performance is “almost identical” for single record updates or retrievals. Customers are more likely to see performance differences in batch and reporting off Eloquence, he added.

Marxmeier said his product fits better into an environment where there’s no onsite experience with Oracle or other mainstream databases. “Really big sites, with 500 or more users, usually have a staff and policy in place needed to keep a mainstream database alive,” he said. “For those customers, it makes sense to look at a mainstream database.”

3000 tool vendors like Robelle, whose Suprtool will support the 7.0 Eloquence release on the day that Marxmeier ships that release, remain optimistic. Foster believes within the next year the database will offer 100 percent of what an application employing IMAGE/SQL needs.

“I think there’s enough people taking a good crack at it,” he said, “so they can integrate it with solutions they’re offering to the customer base as part of a migration target.”